HEAVEN... or HELL???

This is an interesting sign.

HEAVEN up - and HELL down.

Contemplating this picture, I have to say that if given the choice between these two "final destinations," I would have to pick HELL... particularly if Heaven is the Mormon version...

Mormon heaven = Celestial Kingdom.

As Billy Joel said in his song, "Only the Good Die Young"...

They say there's a heaven for those who will wait,

Some say it's better but I say it ain't,

I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints,

The sinners are much more fun...

I totally agree.  Heaven (or the Celestial Kingdom as coined by Joseph Smith) sounds extremely boring with a bunch of Mormons sitting around, reading scriptures.

And the procreating that would be going on.

All that polygamy and no birth control.

Way too many kids, and no Ritalin to be found.  Seriously.

Naturally, we all have preconceived notions about what Heaven is like as opposed to Hell.

HEAVEN is usually depicted as being in the clouds, serene and peaceful.  Everyone dressed in white with angels flying around. 

HELL, on the other hand, is normally pictured as a burning fire of brimstone where everyone will suffer endless torture - the Devil ever present with his pitchfork to help keep control of the masses.

It's interesting to consider different images of HELL and the way it is depicted in various forms.  One of the funniest images of HELL is from Far Side cartoons.  Here's just a few...

Some people can be happy anywhere.  This guy is apparently completely oblivious to the fact that he is in HELL.  The eternal optimist, making the best of a bad situation.  Missing the point entirely.

And the one below has always made me laugh.  Of course, part of the humor for me comes from feeling this way too many times in my life - particularly in one very long-term job I had in Los Angeles working for an abusive boss... and in one of my marriages.  Enough said. 

Of course, no one living knows what HEAVEN and HELL are really like.  One day, we will all find out if either one really exists or if they are both a figment of someone's imagination (into which a lot of people have bought).  I mean, really... when you look at life from a non-religious point of view, things really start to appear differently in many respects, and especially in regard to the purpose of life and the nature of death.  Things don't seem so ominous to me now.  And everything doesn't seem quite so serious as I was lead to believe when I was an active Mormon.

Since leaving Mormonism and organized religion behind, I now consider myself to be Agnostic and really don't know what to believe anymore.  Part of me wants to believe in God and Heaven (just not the Mormon version), and another part of me thinks that perhaps after this life is over, we all cease to exist.  Interestingly, that thought doesn't scare me at all.  For some reason, I was much more frightened and tenuous about afterlife types of questions when I was Mormon.  Probably because I always dreaded the Mormon version of Heaven - the Celestial Kingdom (one of Joseph Smith's inventions).

Here's another very funny Far side cartoon.  Gary Larsen has such an interesting view on things, doesn't he?  I've always loved his cartoons and was very disappointed when he retired in 1995.  But during his career, he produced some very funny cartoons (albeit off-beat), which were also very thought-provoking.  Depicting harps as the musical instrument of choice in Heaven, and accordions as the assigned instrument in Hell.  Very funny. 

But regardless of what our opinions are about life and death, in the end, we will all "shuffle off this mortal coil."  Of course, that term is from William Shakespeare's Hamlet, which contains the "To be or not to be" soliloquy.

William Shakespeare - To be, or not to be (from Hamlet)

To be, or not to be: that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them?  To die: to sleep;
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, 'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish'd. To die, to sleep;
To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there's the rub;
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause: there's the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
The oppressor's wrong, the proud man's contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law's delay,
The insolence of office and the spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscover'd country from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all;
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o'er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action.

Shakespeare offers interesting thoughts on life and the nature of death.  The last part of that soliloquy is especially thought-provoking:  "...the dread of something after death, the undiscover'd country from whose bourn no traveller returns, puzzles the will and makes us rather bear those ills we have than fly to others that we know not of?"  Similar to tolerating the devil we know as opposed to the devil we don't know. 

And what more can be said after Shakespeare has weighed in?
With a few Far Side cartoons thrown in for good measure...

TERRIFYING IMAGES

This picture creates a truly frightening image.  To think that there is someone driving around Utah in this car is a very scary thought.  And to think that this person is apparently also a parent is very scary as well.  Truly, some people should not be parents (a definite case in point of the saying "Just because a person can reproduce doesn't mean they should").  At first, I was caught by the full picture of this car and the terrifying overall image that it creates.  But then I started to look at each individual bumper sticker... and I became even more terrified...

There’s a few I can’t make out completely – like the one that says, “I’d rather be __________” (but I can’t make out the ending).  Another one says “Don’t forget to have Jobs (or have kids?).”  And there’s two or three that I can’t make out at all.  But based on the nature of the rest of these bumper stickers, I’m sure those are just as outlandish and controversial as the others. Truly, I feel very sorry for this person’s children.

Utah license plate with BYU logo and RULDS2

OK, I get it.  You're Mormon.  But you're not only Mormon, you're extreme right-wing Mormon verging on total fanaticism.

Keep Utah Peculiar

Oh, I don't think there's much likelihood of Utah not remaining peculiar, especially with people like this around, driving cars "decorated" like this one.

Beehive State

Utah, the Beehive State, as named by Brigham Young.  A bunch of busy little bees.  Oh yes, this is the place - for a lot of lunatics.

LDS – fish and bumper sticker

Yes, like I said, I get it -- you're LDS...  Mormon... and you like to announce that fact boldly to the world.

Families are Forever

A threat, apparently.  Thankfully, I'm not part of this family.

This Family is Kolob Bound

Ah yes, Kolob... a completely unique Mormon concept.  According to the Book of Abraham which Joseph Smith "translated" from Egyptian papyri, Kolob is the heavenly body nearest to the throne or residence of God.  Of course, Joseph Smith's "translation" is not supported by modern Egytologists.  Thank you, Joseph Smith, for making up this imaginary place - and for giving inspiration to W. W. Phelps who wrote the hymn, "If You Could Hie to Kolob."  One of my favorites.  NOT.

YBU

I guess this means BYU - Brigham Young University - although I'm not sure why the letters are jumbled.  There must be some hidden meaning of which I'm not aware.

Home School – leaving values to the family

Truly, I can't imagine being this person's child let alone being home schooled by him/her. 

WWJD – What would Joseph Do?

Good question.  What would Joseph (Smith) do?  Well, I know what he did.  He made up a religion to gain money and power, and to have his way with all kinds of women (33 in total), including 11 teenaged-girls and 10 women who were already married to living husbands (called polyandry).  He also "translated" gold plates to create the Book of Mormon - and he translated Egyptian papyri to create the Book of Abraham (from which we get the gem of Kolob and other "important doctrine").  He also supposedly had numerous revelations which he compiled into the Doctrine & Covenants - and in that compilation, he included "revelation" about polygamy.  He did forget, however, to include the whole polyandry thing in there - but then he was a Prophet of God so he could do whatever he wanted to do.  And even though he was the Prophet of the Restoration, he was also a "Rough Stone Rolling" as explained by Richard Bushman, so he was still human and made mistakes.  Talk about rationalization.

I ♥ Joseph Smith

Yeah, 33 women ♥'d Joseph Smith and married him - and a bunch more were "sealed" to him as his polygamous wives in the eternities.  Personally, I don't think there's much to ♥ Joseph Smith about.

I’m in Joseph Smith’s Devil Disciples – 1 - 800 - LDS-SCAM

What?  Seriously?  This person is obviously deranged. 

10 Cow Wife

Yeah, sure you are.  Whatever you want to believe, honey.

Jesus Saves

This is followed by some wording that I can't make out.  I just hope Jesus didn't save at the Kirtland Bank.

Sign with red slash mark across the images of two gay men

Of course, it's only appropriate for this person to bring homophobia into this mind-boggling array of bumper stickers.  Maybe this car belongs to the wife or daughter of Boyd K. Packer.

Something or other about the Sanctity of Marriage

(with another red slash across the images of two gay men)

OK, more of the same.  Truly, I don't understand how two people of the same sex getting married is going to destroy the "sacred institution of marriage."  But this person was told to believe that so they do.

Amway

It is only appropriate that an organization like Amway is included in this mish-mash.

Shaklee

Ditto.  Same as above.

Yellow ribbon – Support our Troops

This is probably the only sane sticker on this car.

W ‘04

Of course, looking at all the rest of the stickers on this car, it follows that this person is a Republican.  But not only a Republican - a Republican ala Glenn Beck, Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, and the rest of the right-wing crazies.

Anybody but Hillary

And yes, it follows that this person would be anti-Hillary Clinton.  But what does this really say?  Anybody but Hillary.  Really?  Anybody?

Cheney / Voldemort ‘08

Oh, good idea.  Dick Cheney as President with his Vice Presidential running mate as Voldemort (Ralph Fiennes' character in Harry Potter).  If there was any doubt whatsoever that this person is delusional, this bumper sticker settles the question once and for all.

Of course, fanaticism in any area is harmful.  As the old saying goes, moderation in all things is best.  And driving a car around with all these bumper stickers on it definitely portrays fanatical points of view, at least in my opinion.  I'm just glad this car doesn't belong to any acquaintance of mine.

"BORN AND RAISED MORMON"

I used to very proudly say that I was "Born and Raised Mormon."  But now, that fact seems very detrimental to me.  Perhaps when a person is born and raised in any religion, they tend to just go along from an early age, accepting everything at face value.  Never digging deeper to find out what's really behind the curtain.  Never really thinking about it all or asking any in-depth questions.  Of course, that scenario may not be true for some "Born and Raised Mormons" or some people in other religions, but unfortunately, it was very true for me - and that is something of which I am not proud at all.  There's simply no excuse for ignorance.

Of course, there is the aspect of brainwashing involved.  Being programmed from a very early age.  Being told that something is true from the time of your earliest memories tends to distort reality and make what you are told seem absolutely real and genuine.  And since in the Mormon Church, people are told to only read and study materials that are "authorized," the extent of materials to which most Mormons are exposed is very limited.

Naturally, the term "propaganda" comes to mind.  Although the Mormon Church looks at anything written contrary to what the Mormon Church teaches to be "anti-Mormon propaganda" when much of it is simply highlighting the truth as it really is, pointing out the lies, deception and contradictions that are blatant within Mormon doctrine and history. 

But in reality, the Mormon Church is steeped in the "propaganda" realm.  The church dishes out "propaganda" on a regular basis to its members until their minds are so cluttered with it all that it is difficult to sort out what is true from what is not.  Fast and Testimony Meeting is a prime example of "propaganda" and "brainwashing."  Seeing all those people stand up in church on the first Sunday of every month and say the same rote phrases (like "I know the truth is true beyond a shadow of a doubt" and "I know that Joseph Smith was a Prophet of God") is a very calculated way of indoctrinating the masses and creating "sheeple," something Mormonism seems to have down to a science.

When I read the following quote, it really hit me:

"The oblique paradox of propaganda is that the lie in the throat becomes, by repetition, the truth in the heart."  ~John Grierson

Of course, this is what the Mormon Church is counting on.  Repeating deceitful church doctrines and teachings, over and over again.  And through this process, these fallacies seep into the core of all of its members.  If you tell a person something often enough and long enough, it becomes their reality - and to them, it is true.

It wasn't until 2001, a couple of months prior to going on a Mormon Church History tour, that I began to research the truth behind Mormonism.  At first, I simply wanted to know more about church history prior to going on the trip so I would be more "well-versed" when I visited the key places.  But once I began discovering the truth behind the facade, and I began to look at materials which shed new light on much of what I had believed since childhood, that I began to realize that what I had been told was simply not true. 

One by one, I began to discover the truth about polygamy, polyandry, the differing versions of the First Vision (totaling at least nine), the truth behind why Joseph Smith was arrested and incarcerated in Carthage Jail as well as his supposed "martyrdom," the Book of Mormon, the Book of Abraham, the Kinderhook Plates, Blacks and the Priesthood, and on and on - and as I did, I began to realize how blind I had been over the years.  At that point, the following quote began to take on new meaning - "There are none so blind as those who will not see." (Attributed to Thomas Chalkley, circa 1713, but most likely based on the Biblical verse in Jeremiah 5:21, "Hear now this, O foolish people, and without understanding; which have eyes, and see not; which have ears, and hear not.")

In everyone's lifetime, people occasionally come upon pivotal moments or crossroads.  As Robert Frost said in his poem "The Road Not Taken": 

Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, 

And sorry I could not travel both 

And be one traveler, long I stood 

And looked down one as far as I could 

To where it bent in the undergrowth;

Then took the other, as just as fair, 

And having perhaps the better claim, 

Because it was grassy and wanted wear; 

Though as for that the passing there 

Had worn them really about the same,

And both that morning equally lay 

In leaves no step had trodden black. 

Oh, I kept the first for another day! 

Yet knowing how way leads on to way, 

I doubted if I should ever come back.

I shall be telling this with a sigh 

Somewhere ages and ages hence: 

Two roads diverged in a wood, and I— 

I took the one less traveled by, 

And that has made all the difference.

Very poignant poem that makes a very profound point.  It reminds me of a few experiences in my life, but most vividly brings to mind my journey away from Mormonism. 

So from 2001 to 2004, I found myself at a very pivotal point in my life - a definite crossroads - as I struggled with what I had been taught and had believed my entire life.  At first, I was very confused as fear and doubt took over my psyche.  After all, I was ripping up and examining the very foundation of my life since Mormonism had always been practically my identity.  But at times, I would feel hope and wonderment, and that's what kept me going on the path toward final acceptance of the fact that I had been living a lie.  When I found the graphic rendering posted here, it really hit home since these are the emotions I dealt with during this time frame.

In the end, though, as I sorted through all of the information I had uncovered along with all of these emotions, I began to realize that I couldn't reverse the process through which I had gone.  I couldn't go back in time to return to the state of blissful ignorance I had dwelled in for so long.  Of course, when I was still Mormon, I had some questions and issues (such as the role of women in the church and what I perceived as a double standard), but I had successfully put those things on my "shelf" up until that point.  But as I came to terms with this newly-discovered information, I was unable to put anything more on my "shelf," and it all came tumbling down.

In looking back at my life, I do have some regrets.  One of my regrets is that I didn't become more intellectually curious at an earlier time in my life.  Perhaps if I had researched the doctrines, teachings and history of the Mormon Church in more detail and on an independent basis, not relying solely on what I was told or read from "authorized" sources, I would have discovered the truth much earlier.  Unfortunately, I spent 52 years as a Mormon simply because I paid too much attention to what they told me to believe.  One of my other regrets is that I did not tell my father that I had disassociated myself from the Mormon Church before he passed away.  He died in May 2006, and although I left the church in 2004, I never told him that I had left the church - and why.  Of course, since he was 90 years old in 2004, I knew that if I told him, that it would very possibly drive a wedge between us since he was very pious and dogmatic about Mormonism.  So that was my rationale.  And since he lived in Utah and I lived in California, it was rather easy to live that charade.

But still, although I regret not telling my father about my apostasy and why I left the church, I am grateful that I am now living a completely authentic life.  And of course, getting caught up in the "shoulda, woulda, coulda" mindset only succeeds in putting negative vibes in a person's life, so I have shed all of that and am moving forward with a positive attitude.  Finally being true to who I really am - and not living a lie.  And that's enough for me.

"APOSTATES" and "ANTI-MORMON PROPAGANDA"

The term "apostate" is a label with very negative connotations, like the term "anti" (as in "anti-Mormon propaganda").  In my opinion, using that label is one of the ways that the higher-ups try to control the masses.  Terming something "anti" makes all Mormons cringe, and they usually immediately condemn the person "spouting the anti-Mormon propaganda" as they begin to defend their religion.  Defending one's beliefs is fine as long as those beliefs are defendable, but in the case of most Mormons, they simply repeat what they are told to believe, not beliefs that they have formed through any independent study.

Since it is independent study from "unauthorized sources" that eventually led me away from Mormonism, I question even more than I would have previously as to why those sources are termed "unauthorized" when they do not tell lies, but rather the truth.  But then, since the Mormon Church tends to play very fast and loose with the truth, relying on its version of things is not wise.  Looking at that "directive" not to do "research from unauthorized sources" also brings up the very strong possibility that the Mormon Church is actually a cult since that is one of the characteristics of cultism.  If an organization is above board in their doctrines and teachings then research from "unauthorized sources" shouldn't make any difference.  But if that organization directs its members to only research and study from materials they authorize, red flags should go up immediately.

So many Mormons truly believe that looking at "unauthorized" information leads to APOSTASY, and since they are told that apostasy is the most abhorrent sin, they steer clear of any materials considered to be "anti," including information that would shed light on the reality behind it all.  But if indeed "the Glory of God is intelligence," then true believing Mormons are also denying the validity of that statement.

Sadly, most Mormons will never be able to look beyond the "anti" label to get to the core of the lies perpetuated by the LDS Church.  The internet contains links to a plethora of information that shows without any doubt that the Mormon Church is not true, but most Mormons will never even read or consider this information because of the "anti" label given to it.  Truth is but a click away -- and to paraphrase a popular Mormon scripture, "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of Google."

But while Mormonism is obviously built on an elaborate web of lies, so many people continue to go along with it, defending its deceptions and contradictions, claiming to believe in it all "by faith."  I simply don't understand their logic, because when the facts contradict what a person is told to believe by faith, it is not faith anymore, but rather denial.

I am so glad that I finally saw the light and realized that the Mormon Church is not only untrue, but that its teachings and doctrines are detrimental to my mental health and well-being.  Blindly following things that you are told to believe is not healthy.  Doing your own research and deciding on your own is the best course of action for any person.  Rationalizing out the lies, deceptions, cover-ups and contradictions only leads to accepting things that eat away at your ability to think for yourself and formulate your own opinions. 

Making a 180 and turning away from Mormonism was the best thing I ever did.  I do not regret for one second being an "apostate" despite its negative connotations in religious circles.  I only wish I had apostatized much earlier in my life.  Hanging on to thoughts and ideas simply because I was told to do so was killing me inside.  That type of conformity creates a mind-numbing existence that is very difficult to reverse. 

Being born and raised Mormon, I was programmed from a very early age to not question, to have faith, to just believe.  Once I reached my teenage years, though, I began to question not only the doctrine but also the way in which women are treated as second-class citizens.  But being the good little Mormon clone that I was back then, I shelved all those thoughts and tried to continue to go along with the program for many more years.

So when you get right down to it, I guess I was a "future apostate" for many years before becoming one in reality.  And as shown in this picture, it isn't very hard to spot the "future apostate" since they are the ones who tend to look in the other direction from the masses, looking for answers to complex questions, instead of just going along (like the "sheeple" tend to do).  But although I probably was a "future apostate" for many years, I wish that I had begun to question more deeply earlier in my life.  Woulda, Shoulda, Coulda, I suppose...

But even so, I'm just glad I finally recognized the truth when I did instead of simply going along with all the lies all my entire life.

MORMON BRAINWASHING AT ITS BEST

Oh yes, the brainwashing within Mormonism is endless... and it starts at a very early age. People sit in Fast & Testimony meeting (first Sunday of every month), and when little children such as this little girl get up, they think "Oh, how cute."  And yes, it is cute... just adorable.  But it is also very disturbing because the children are simply parroting what they are told at home and in church.  These thoughts, of course, settle in their brains - and all of that, along with the programming they get at home and in Primary (the children's organization in the Mormon Church) with lessons and "singing time," the brainwashing starts to take full effect, as it becomes embedded in their brains.  Between being taught Primary songs like "Search, Ponder and Pray," "Jesus Wants Me for a Sunbeam," "The Golden Plates," and "Book of Mormon Stories," and the constant lessons about various religious themes, most very Mormon in nature, the programming takes root.  And before long -- voilà, they are brainwashed.  The next generation of Morgbots.

Looking back, I don't know what is more upsetting to me... the fact that I was brainwashed as a child, or the fact that I essentially participated in the brainwashing of my daughter.  Naturally, since I was “born under the covenant” (a Mormon term for anyone who is born to parents who have been sealed in the Mormon temple) and married in the temple to her father, my daughter was also “born under the covenant.”  And yes, she used to get up in Fast & Testimony meeting and bear her testimony (just like I did when I was a child and as an adult).  That image is burned into my brain, and it really bothers me.

The thing that bothers me the most, though, is that if I had followed my instincts, I would have stopped being Mormon before my daughter was even baptized – and that would have been over 20 years ago.  At that point in my life, I had already begun to realize many of the negative influences of Mormonism in my life, including the fact that the Mormon Church is a male-oriented, male-dominated, double-standard religious institution that brainwashes its members and uses guilt to try to control them.  I had also begun to question whether I wanted my daughter to be brought up any further in the Mormon Church, and I had begun to think about not having her baptized when she turned 8 years old.  It was with those thoughts in mind that I stopped going to church when my daughter was 7 years old around the time that I married my second, non-Mormon husband, and I didn't go or take my daughter to church for over 6 months.  But unfortunately, the guilt began seeping in and I began to realize that if I didn't have her baptized, I would be making a public pronouncement of having left Mormonism – and because my father was very pious and dogmatic about Mormonism, and I was afraid to tell him (even though he lived in Utah and I lived in California), I began taking my daughter to church again and had her baptized when she turned 8.  For that, I could kick myself to this day.

Luckily, though, my daughter realized that Mormonism is a pile of garbage on her own, when she was a teenager (although she continued to go not only to church but also to 4 years of early-morning Seminary) – and she finally stopped going to church when she was 21.  As it turned out, she and I had parallel, but separate, journeys away from Mormonism – hers while she was living on her own, going to school in Salt Lake City, Utah (in an apartment that is only 5 blocks from Temple Square), and mine at home in California.  When she came back from Utah, I decided to tell her that I had abandoned Mormonism because I didn't want to pretend that I was still going to church – and when I told her, I could see the relief on her face before she told me the same thing.  When I began telling her my reasons, including the fact that I had discovered so many lies and contradictions, she literally finished my sentences for me, showing that she had discovered a lot of the same things as I had.   It was very much a bonding moment, and I will never forget it. 

One of the funniest parts of my daughter opening up to me about her long-term doubts about Mormonism was her description of me as "Mormon Mommy."  When I told her that I had disassociated myself from the LDS Church, she told me that she was very happy that “Mormon Mommy” had gone away.  Apparently, she always dreaded it when I would become "adamant" about various aspects of Mormonism (calling that aspect of my personality “Mormon Mommy”), and liked me much better during the times when I relaxed and was less concerned about it all.  It really made me laugh – but it also made me examine myself and the way it which I had appeared, not only to her but to others.  That revelation really made a deep impact on me, and has been invaluable to me over the years.

Naturally, active Mormons deny that brainwashing or programming takes place within the Mormon Church just as they deny that Mormonism is actually a cult.  But it becomes very apparent when reading about the characteristics of cults, and its definition, that Mormonism is the epitome of cultism.  Denying the obvious is useless.

CIRCULAR REASONING

I've been doing some research about this topic lately, and I find it to be a very interesting subject.  Of course, since beginning my journey away from Mormonism, the process of reasoning, thinking, analyzing, evaluating and arriving at my own conclusion has become much more vivid in my mind.  For so many years, I just went along - and I was sadly caught in the never-ending cycle of Circular Reasoning.  Breaking away from that vicious cycle was difficult, as was leaving the Mormon mindset behind, but the benefits have been numerous.  Knowing that I am thinking for myself now, and that I am living an authentic life, is a huge reward.

When looking at the FAIR and FARMS websites, I can now see just how deeply Mormon apologists are caught in a cycle of Circular Reasoning.  Since their initial premise which underlies everything they say or think is that "the Mormon Church is the only true church on the face of the earth," they bend each fact to that end.  And when they seem caught, they simply bear their testimony.  Now that solves everything, doesn't it?

Independent, unbiased deliberation requires abandoning all preconceived notions, but since they do not leave anything on the table before beginning their studies, it is not possible for them to reach an unbiased opinion.  They close their minds before even beginning the process of "studying" the question - and they have arrived at their conclusion before beginning the "analysis" as well. 

A classic example of Circular Reasoning was apparent to me when I told my very TBM brother that I was no longer going to church.  Of course, his first response was that "it's never too late" to return to the fold.  When I told him that I didn't want to "return," he said, "Well, it all boils down to whether or not you believe that Joseph Smith was a Prophet of God.  If you believe he was a Prophet of God, then the church is true.  But if you believe that he wasn't a Prophet of God, then the church is not true.  That being said, I believe that Joseph Smith was a Prophet of God, and therefore the Church is true."  Circular Reasoning in a capsule.

On the Logical Fallacies website, the following is said about Circular Reasoning:

Begging the Question / Circular Reasoning

Explanation

An argument is circular if its conclusion is among its premises, if it assumes (either explicitly or not) what it is trying to prove. Such arguments are said to beg the question. A circular argument fails as a proof because it will only be judged to be sound by those who already accept its conclusion.

Anyone who rejects the argument’s conclusion should also reject at least one of its premises (the one that is the same as its conclusion), and so should reject the argument as a whole. Anyone who accepts all of the argument’s premises already accepts the argument’s conclusion, so can’t be said to have been persuaded by the argument. In neither case, then, will the argument be successful.

Example:

(1) The Bible affirms that it is inerrant.

(2) Whatever the Bible says is true.

Therefore:

(3) The Bible is inerrant.

This argument is circular because its conclusion—The Bible is inerrant—is the same as its second premise—Whatever the Bible says is true. Anyone who would reject the argument’s conclusion should also reject its second premise, and, along with it, the argument as a whole.

Real-World Examples

The above argument is a straightforward, real-world example of a circular argument. Other examples can be a little more subtle.

Typical examples of circular arguments include rights-claims: e.g., “I have a right to say what I want, therefore you shouldn’t try to silence me”; “Women have a right to choose whether to have an abortion or not, therefore abortion should be allowed”; “The unborn has a right to life, therefore abortion is immoral.”

Having a right to X is the same as other people having an obligation to allow you to have X, so each of these arguments begs the question, assuming exactly what it is trying to prove.

Of course, religion is an area in which Circular Reasoning is used to try to explain much of its rhetoric.  The statement that the Bible is the Word of God because the Bible tells us so, and since the Bible is infallible it is obviously the Word of God is a great example of Circular Reasoning. 

Naturally, though, when caught in the web of Circular Reasoning, particularly in a religious discussion, it is very difficult to make the other person see the errors in his/her line of thinking.  Knowing that the Bible is the Word of God simply because the Bible tells us so, and since the Bible is infalliable, it is therefore true is a mind-boggling statement.  Of course, many Mormons believe the Book of Mormon is true because they have been told it is true by their leaders, and since they believe their leaders are lead by God, they assume that nothing those leaders say or do could possibly be wrong.  Getting in these types of discussions can be very frustrating for a thinking human being.

On Yahoo Answers, the following question was asked:  "Is it circular reasoning to quote the Bible as proof of God?"

Here was the answer:  "If they could quote a verse of the Bible that describes an occurrence or a phenomena (that mere mortals could not have known) that was only later confirmed by an extra-biblical source, then the Bible may serve as evidence. But to date, I've only heard outrageous interpretations ("See this verse that says rivers don't fill up, that's clearly a reference to the complicated water cycle we only now understand") or blatant ignorance ("See this verse written a few years after this war, it predicted that war")."

Here's a few very good examples of Circular Reasoning, which I found on a discussion board on http://www.camaroz28.com/forums:

We're doing 10 minute presentations in English and I'm doing mine on fallacy number 21: Circular Reasoning.  For those who don't know what circular reasoning means, here's an example:

And one of the responses:

Is there a God?  Yes.
How do you know?  Because the Bible says so.
How do you know the Bible is correct?  Because it was inspired by God.

In other words - God is because God is.

And here's one of the responses:

Why don't atheists believe in God?
Because they have no faith.

Why do they have no faith?
Because they don't believe in God.

Hence, atheists don't believe in God because they have no faith, or they don't have faith because they have no belief.

Okay, here's another less inflammatory example.

I am rude and discourteous to women.
Why?  Because women are evil.

Why are women evil?
Because men are rude and discourteous to women.

Or how about this?

Did your significant other cheat on you?  When you ask them if they cheated, they said they didn't.  But you knew they were lying because all cheaters lie.

Basically assumption or conjecture is the mother of circular logic.

Interesting statement.  "Basically assumption or conjecture is the mother of circular logic."  Without any type of "proof," some religious people try to argue that God exists through circular logic.  It's one thing to say that they believe in God because they have faith in his existence, but it is another thing entirely to try to "prove" his existence through use of the Bible or other religious-based "evidence."  But Mormon apologists go several steps further in trying to "prove" that Mormonism is true.

While I overlooked the circular arguments for a very long time, and bought into Mormonism lock, stock and barrel, eventually I realized that the whole thing makes no sense.  And after doing extensive research, I finally realized that everything I had been taught since childhood was filled with lies and deception, as well as contradictions and cover-ups.  At that point, it felt as though my head was going to explode.  Since I had never really thought about it all before, I came to realize that those feelings were simply mind opening up to real thinking, examination, evaluation, interpretation and analysis.  Deciding for myself - not relying on what others had told me to believe.  At this point, I consider myself to be an Agnostic because I do not know one way or the other whether God exists, and I don't feel comfortable taking the leap to atheism because it may very well be that God does exist.  But whether he exists or not, I know for certain that the Mormon Church is NOT his "only true church on the face of the earth."

While I was doing research on Circular Reasoning, I came across some interesting information on http://www.urbandictionary.com/, which gives examples of Circular Reasoning as:

"I'm right because I'm right."

"There isn't a problem with the rule, because if everyone obeyed it there wouldn't be a problem."

"Piracy is wrong because it's against the law, and it's against the law because it's wrong."

"X is stupid because he's an idiot."

The Urban Dictionary website also gives a definition for "Circular Logic," reiterating the religious argument of:

Atheist: How do you know God exists?Believer: The Bible says so. Atheist: How do you know the Bible is the absolute truth?Believer: Because it came from God.Atheist: How do you know God exists?

and so on...

Some closing thoughts:  

It may have been better to say, "Circular reasoning"; circular logic strikes me as oxymoronic.

 

I don't use circular reasoning in my arguments. I know this because my arguments are never circular.

(Both of the above quotes were by "Wandering Soul," posted on http://www.religiousforums.com/, 1-23-2011, 2:30 pm).

And just remember:

Circular reasoning is not logically valid because it isn't.

THE BOOK OF MORMON MUSICAL ON BROADWAY

Leave it to the creators of South Park to bring The Book of Mormon to Broadway!!  Of course, this production is obviously causing all kinds of consternation amongst the "Big 15" in SLC - and I'm sure there are a lot of Mormons who are appropriately shocked.  But at this point in my "apostate" life, what the suits in SLC or Mormons in general think is the last thing on my mind.  Actually, I find the whole thing extremely amusing.  Having watched some clips from the BoM musical, as well as reading a number of articles, it is clear that this musical lives up to the hype of being not only controversial, but also irreverent and blasphemous.  Vogue Magazine called the show "the filthiest, most offensive, and - surprise - sweetest thing you’ll see on Broadway this year, and quite possibly the funniest musical ever."

If anybody had told me when I was growing up that one day there would be a musical on Broadway about the Book of Mormon, I would have told them they were NUTS!!  But here it is in 2011... and isn't it GREAT!!!

HERE'S WORDING FROM THE SHOW'S WEBSITE:

From Trey Parker and Matt Stone, four-time Emmy Award-winning creators of South Park comes this hilarious Broadway musical about a pair of mismatched Mormon boys sent on a mission to a place that’s about as far from Salt Lake City as you can get. The Book of Mormon is written in collaboration with Robert Lopez, the Tony Award-winning writer of Avenue Q, and co-directed by Mr. Parker and three-time Tony nominee Casey Nicholaw (Spamalot, The Drowsy Chaperone). Previews begin at the Eugene O'Neill Theatre on February 24, 2011.

Contains explicit language.

http://www.bookofmormonbroadway.com/the-show   

HERE'S A COUPLE GREAT PROMOS FOR THE SHOW:

AND HERE'S AN INTERVIEW WITH THE CREATORS,
TREY PARKER AND MATT STONE:

Of course, a lot of controversy about the Book of Mormon precedes this musical.  Back in the 1800's, when Mormonism made its debut in upstate New York, and then made its trek from New York to Ohio to Missouri to Illinois and then to Utah, Mark Twain (1835-1910) made some very interesting comments about Mormonism. 

The following is an excerpt from "Roughing It - A Personal Narrative," written by Mark Twain after a two-day stopover in Salt Lake City on his way to silver mines in Nevada.

All men have heard of the Mormon Bible, but few, except the elect have seen it or at least taken the trouble to read it. I brought away a copy from Salt Lake. The book is a curiosity to me. It is such a pretentious affair and yet so slow, so sleepy, such an insipid mess of inspiration. It is chloroform in print.

If Joseph Smith composed this book, the act was a miracle. Keeping awake while he did it, was at any rate. If he, according to tradtion, merely translated it from certain ancient and myteriously engraved plates of copper, which he declares he found under a stone, in an out of the way locality, the work of translating it was equally a miracle for the same reason.

I love the "chloroform in print" comment.  Classic.

In another part of that article, Mark Twain went on to say:

Some people have to have a world of evidence before they can come anywhere in the neighborhood of believing anything, but for me when a man tells me that he has seen the engravings which are upon the plates and not only that, but an angel was there at the time and saw them see him and probably took his receipt for it, I am very far on the road to conviction no matter whether I have ever heard of that man before or not, and even if I do not know the name of the angel or his nationality either.

One of Mark Twain's final comments from the end of this section is as follows:

The Mormon Bible is rather stupid and tiresome to read. But there is nothing vicious in its teachings. Its code of morals is unobjectionable. It's smooched from the New Testament and no credit given.
 

Reading all his thoughts on Mormonism and the Book of Mormon (or the "Mormon Bible" as he calls it) makes me wonder what Mark Twain would think about this musical.  I would love to hear his comments today.  I'm sure what he would have to say would be CLASSIC!!

Of course, the Mormon Church released a statement about the Book of Mormon musical saying, "The production may attempt to entertain audiences for an evening, but the Book of Mormon as a volume of scripture will change people's lives forever by bringing them closer to Christ."  Interesting.  Of course, since I believe that the Book of Mormon is not scripture, and is in fact plagiarized from other writings of the time (like View of the Hebrews by Ethan Smith and manucripts written by Solomon Spalding), and that Joseph Smith wrote (not translated) the Book of Mormon with the help of Sydney Rigdon, the likelihood of it changing people's lives by bringing them closer to Christ is a fraudulent statement.  The Book of Mormon, after all, is a complete farce, as is the rest of Mormonism.

But at least Joseph Smith has provided us with the basis for some great entertainment.  And we can thank him for that.